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Archive for the ‘Double Glazing’ Category

Interview with Alan Fielder of Edgetech

Wednesday, March 10th, 2010

Alan Fielder small

How do you feel the impending changes to compliance with building regulations in October will affect the industry as a whole?

My feeling is it will have a tremendous affect on the entire industry. If the proposed Building Regulations are passed every single replacement window sold will have to have a C rating with the British Fenestration Ratings Council. This will impact on every business throughout the supply chain as suppliers will need to ensure they are supplying energy efficient alternatives, just as window companies will need to ensure they are using the most advanced technologies to meet legislation. 

Do you feel that companies in our industry are ready for these changes?

While there are forward thinking companies that embraced Window Energy Ratings as the differentiating opportunity they were early on, the majority of the market still hasn’t achieved a Window Energy Rating and if anything are as confused and worried about the process of getting one as they ever have been. They have had plenty of time but they haven’t taken any action. 

Even for those companies with Window Energy Ratings on their standard window – when they put fully reinforced (e.g. foiled) windows through the same process for example, will they still achieve a C rating? And if they do, will they be able to afford to put all of their combinations of windows through the process? 

It would also seem that there are numerous companies who believe that because their window achieves the perfromance required for a given rating, they are entitled to sell their products as energy rated. This is not the case. A window only has a BFRC Window Energy Rating when it has gone through the WER submission process, when it is registered at www.bfrc.org and when it carries the appropriate label. 

That’s why Edgetech has launched the ‘Journey to C’ initiative (www.journeytoc.co.uk) – the nationwide series of FREE workshops to help companies achieve the ratings they need. We recognise what a huge challenge this is for the industry and wanted to offer as much practical support for companies still daunted by the WER process or confused about how the proposed changes to Building Regulations will affect them.  

There seems to be a lot of concern about the real value of solar gain, which plays a major part in calculating a window’s energy rating. Do you feel U-Values are a better way of comparing different windows relative energy efficiency?

It would seem to me to be just as daft to ignore solar gain as it is to overrate it. Cleverer men than me have put their heads together to come up with a rating system that has the approval of government. I don’t really believe that CLG are adopting the BFRC Window Energy Rating scheme as the preferred method of Document L compliance because it is perfect but rather because it is there, it is functional and it is cost effective. To that end I prefer to get on with helping companies get on board with it, use it to their commercial advantage and get on with running their businesses. 

Personally, I’m concerned that having WERs as the only way of complying wit building regulations will stifle innovation, choice and create problems should any company in the supply chain cease trading. For example, what will an installer do if the company they purchase sealed units from ceases trading? Surely there needs to be a quick way for installers and fabricators to switch to an equivalent product from an equivalent supplier?

I understand your concern but there are provisions within the BFRC for licence submissions to include more than one supplier and the Licence of Addition option enables licence holders to use more than one supplier and more than one glazing combination in their WER offering. 

Following on from the above question, we currently have our energy rated windows tested with Swisspacer. Assuming Super Spacer is a similar Warm Edge product, what process would Conservatory Outlet and its installers have to go through to make such a minor alteration? How long would it take and what costs associated? 

Well of course I wouldn’t consider our unique Super Spacer product to be ‘similar’ to anything else! But for the purpose of your question, to make any product component changes; frame, mullion, sash, glazing bead, glass, spacer, glazing cavity fill, gasketry or even reinforcement requires a new thermal simulation report and possibly a new system air leakage report. This would then need a new BFRC submission and a new licence. This process need not take any longer than a week or two depending on the availability of the required technical reports and the workload at BFRC and your Independent Agent. The reports should be available from systems suppliers either free or at nominal cost, though if you have to get your own simulation reports done they will cost you somewhere between £500 and £1500 each. The change should be able to be incorporated into your existing IA audit regime so there should only be nominal costs involved here though this will need to be clarified with your IA. Current BFRC licence cost is £200 per product per annum. 

I understand there are currently around 300 companies in the UK with an energy rating but FENSA claim to have over 9000 companies in their scheme. Can the simulators simulate, the IAs audit and the BFRC register the rest of the industry by October? 

The simple answer is probably not. Before launching our ‘Journey to C’ initiative we considered very carefully the timing of the events and decided not to delay because if the proposed Building Regulations are approved in April, the industry would have even less time to prepare. ‘Journey to C’ will only scratch the surface of what needs to be done but at least we’re doing all we can to support our customers and potential customers meet up and coming legislation.  

Of course now we risk the Building Regulations not being passed or being changed, but in our view although this removes the urgency, the market will continue to move towards Window Energy Ratings and I honestly believe that companies without a rating will soon start to feel the pinch if they’re not already. 

Do you think that these proposed changes will ultimately force many smaller sealed unit manufacturers, PVC-U fabricators and installers out of business? 

I don’t think this will necessarily be the case but of course with any huge shift in legislation that let’s not forget costs a lot of money, this is a risk. All the more reason however to be prepared sooner rather than later. It’s the smaller companies that sit back and wait to see what happens with Building Regulations and how it will affect them, that will be caught short. Smaller companies that grab the bull by the horns have every chance of stealing a march on their competitors if they act sooner rather than later. 

While I understand that many people are fearful of the consequences of the proposed changes and nobody actually wants to see change for the sake of change, and I also understand that some sectors see current trends and proposed legislation as restrictive to their historic trading patterns, we are operating against a backdrop where the need to reduce emissions, provide ourselves with some energy security and conserve our fossil resources while we develop renewables, means that to just carry on as we are is no longer an option. 

In the bigger picture, governments the world over (I know there are some exceptions, but in the main) are looking to bring about fundamental changes in human behaviour on both individual and social fronts. Why should we be any different? A lot of the changes we will have to go through as individuals and as an industry may not be very comfortable but change we have to, and change we inevitably will.

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For more information about Edgetech visit http://www.superspacer.co.uk/

Just an idea I thought I’d run by you

Monday, March 8th, 2010

OK, I’ve probably not thought this through properly, and am very much talking aloud with this post.  So, please be gentle with me if I’m miles offside here.

But, I’ve been thinking about the previous post with the £2080 window sale, and also the debate I sparked about upselling.

It was clear that most of the readers of this blog believe in pricing windows and doors fairly.  In other words, a price that is fair for the customer and fair for the company.  The company is generating enough money from the sale to sustain their business and make a small profit, and the customer is not ripped off and happy with the price.

So, what about if there was a website available with a national window and door price list which both customers and companies could work from?  I’m not talking about one of those lead generating websites where a customer can get a wildly inflated price if they divulge their details, and then get pestered by 3 companies.

I’m talking of an agreed pricing structure which customers can look at freely, and without having to supply their details.  The prices are realistic – not inflated for discounting by a salesman, or ridiculously cheap so that upselling is required.  Just fair prices for both the customer and the company.

Then, companies who are happy to sell windows and doors at these fair prices can sign up to the price list, and have their details listed on the website.  If a customer likes the prices on the website then they can contact any of the companies listed.

There’d need to be assurances from the companies taking part that they will work to the price list, and a small degree of flexibility of prices would need factoring in for regional and installation variations.

In the same way that David asked in the previous post ‘am I being too soft’, I’m wondering ‘am I being realistic?’

No doubt people from our industry will have the following doubts:

  • It’s a salesman’s job to work quotes out.
  • I wouldn’t want my competitors knowing my prices.

Like I’ve said, I’m just thinking aloud.  If a website existed that gave consumers a pretty accurate price for windows and doors, and generated leads for those companies associated then maybe that could be a good thing….

Good salesman or Rogue Trader?

Monday, March 8th, 2010

Guest Post by David

Sat a lead yesterday with a frail old lady in her eighties. She had already had a few windows done by one of the Nationals.

After a chat she revealed what she had paid for these windows and even showed me her invoice. The reputable company in question had charged the poor soul £2080.00 for one 1800×1200 window with 2 opening casements. The maximum retail we would charge on this would be about £500.00 max.

I do feel that they had taken advantage somewhat of a fairly vulnerable old lady.  Any company with less of a reputation would be classed as a rip off merchant and rogue trader. What are your renegade thoughts. Am I just too soft?

Regards

David

Respect your customer’s time

Monday, February 15th, 2010

Guest post by Dave Blakeman of RPS

When a salesperson visits a customer, I believe they should show respect for that customer’s time. It’s remarkably simple (but rare) for a salesperson to put themselves in the customer’s shoes. This invoves doing simple things:-

Arrive when promised
Don’t out-stay your welcome
Do what you promised by when you promised it

In addition, I have a suggestion for the retail conservatory sales world. As a gesture of respect for the customer’s time, why not send them a small box of chocolates (or an M&S voucher) along with your quotation? And a small note saying “your time is important to me – please accept this as a small token for taking the time to see me”.

Say this costs £10/customer. Benefits would be:

1. The customer will be amazed – this is not how double glazing companies are expected to behave!
2. It’s almost inconceivable that your competition would do the same thing, so you’ve already ticked a “special” box that people didn’t realise existed!
3. If you don’t win the job, you’ll be in a great position to ask why. That feedback is invaluable – you’ve already given something special to the customer, and they will feel obliged to give you an honest answer back, rather than just fobbing you off with “the other quote was less” (price is a great excuse, but rarely the main reason to choose someone else)
4. Whether you win the job or not, you can be pretty certain the customer will tell others about it.
Sounds like £10 well spent to me (especially in the current climate). I’m not sure it would have the same impact in trade-trade sales, but we might well try it anyway!

If anyone decides to try this, let me know how it goes!

Dave is the MD of RPS (Roofwright) and has his own blog which is definitely worth following at:

http://daveblakeman.wordpress.com/

Insider secrets – what the other companies don’t want you to know!

Sunday, February 14th, 2010

Guest post by Hazel

I wasn’t sure whether to post this as it gives away many of our industry’s best secrets. But what the heck! Our industry has a bad reputation and only by companies and their employees gradually stamping out these practices will we have customers welcoming our sales staff into their homes without the current mistrust:

Don’t arrange for a quote until you have read this….

It could save you from being ripped off, regretting your decision, or wasting hours with a high pressure salesperson. Windows, doors, conservatories, etc, are all a major investment.

A few minutes studying this will give you the inside information you need to see through many double glazing tricks, old and new. You are unlikely to find all this information anywhere else, simply because the other window companies don’t want you to know!

door-to-door-salesman2

By exposing these secrets, we are putting YOU, the customer, in control.

Please read this carefully as it will save you time and money.

Almost every window company you can think of pays their sales people no basic salary at all. They earn commission only if they sell to you. (The very few exceptions to this are mostly small, local companies).

However many of the smaller companies that appear to be caring, local firms now employ reps who have worked for the larger national ones & pay them in the same way. Once you have read the sales tactics below you will easily be able to spot these.)

What does this mean to you, the customer?

1. The more they can charge you for your windows, the more money they will earn, as they are on a percentage.
2. If you don’t buy from them they earn nothing; in fact it will have cost them petrol money to visit you.
3. They get more commission if you use their finance scheme.

Now you can see why so many sales reps start at a very high price & can then magically discount it, sometimes by thousands of pounds in a very short time.

They don’t really expect you to say yes to their first ridiculous price, but if you do they will happily take your money & pocket lots of extra commission.

If you don’t, they can then use their “discounts” to persuade you to “do it now”, thereby making sure you don’t shop around & they still get their sale. Most reps are under great pressure to get your business on their first visit. Sales Managers constantly tell them that EVERYONE will “buy on the night” if they have a good enough reason to.

Some of the common high-pressure sales tactics are as follows:

The Call to the Manager:
This is to convince you that they have gone to great trouble to get you a “special deal” if you sign up today.
It is just an act – the rep already knows exactly what price he can go down to. He will usually express great surprise that the manager can do it at such a good price for you!

The Show Home Promotion:
A huge discount for having a board outside your house, and in the case of some companies, the chance to feature in their magazine & get your windows for free if you win their draw.
Of course it is a very limited offer & you have to sign up immediately to get it. And your house is always in exactly the location they are looking for.
Just an inflated price, with a false discount. Have you ever met anyone who did get their windows for free? This has been running for years.
Most local companies do ask if they can place a board outside for a short time when they are installing. It shows they are proud of the job they have done & helps them get more business. But there is no way they can give you a huge discount for this, or replace your windows at a loss to themselves in return for the advertising.

“I’m not a sales rep, I’m the area manager (or from the trade department, or the owner’s son)”
Some companies train every sales rep to say this!
The rep who should have visited you is always off sick, been in an accident, his wife is having a baby etc. So they have come instead so they don’t let you down, even though it’s not their job.
If you buy off them tonight you will save money as you won’t be paying the rep’s commission. Now you think they must be such a nice person & you are getting a bargain.
Of course all they are doing is putting pressure on you to sign up, and it is almost certain that anyone who uses this line IS on commission & your windows are no cheaper.

Huge discounts, usually from 35% to 50% off
To qualify for these you usually have to sign up there & then. The price has been inflated & they pretend to give you this special offer.
As with the “call to the manager” they will want a commitment that you WILL buy tonight IF they can give you a special “discount”.
Again, you will have been pressurised & your windows may still cost more than they should have done.
But you believe you have got thousands of pounds off & you could never have afforded them otherwise.
You haven’t “beaten them down”, you have just played the game they have been trained to get you to play!

“Have the front done & get the back done free” or “Buy one, get one free”
All they do is charge you more for some windows & pretend others are free.
Try saying you’ve already had the back done & only want the front at their best price. Then change your mind & decide you do want the back after all – sure enough you will find the back is not “free” any more!

“A large commercial contract has just cancelled”.
Also commonly used as a reason to pester you later if you didn’t sign up on the night. Some companies send a letter claiming this has happened to every customer who didn’t buy from them.
Again just a ploy to make you believe you are getting a great deal! Magically the gap in their order book is always exactly when you wanted your windows fitted!
A similar ploy is a call from the “trade department” offering you the windows cheaper.

I need a deposit to “hold the price”
Your windows will NOT cost any more tomorrow or even next week. They just want you to part with some money & give them a firm order so you don’t look elsewhere for a better deal.
Remember that by law you have seven days to cancel any contract you sign in your home.

Window Scrappage Schemes or “We pay you for your old windows”.
There is NO national government scrappage scheme for windows.
Cleverly invented by some large national companies to mimic the wording (scrappage) & amount (£2,000) of the genuine car scrappage scheme.
Some have been forced to amend their misleading advertising slightly due to the number of complaints, but it is currently still the most convincing double glazing scam ever.
Other companies admit the government isn’t yet doing this, but because they “care about the environment”, they will give you money back to scrap your old windows anyway.
Extensively advertised on TV & radio, and sounds believable.
Save money AND save the planet! We all want to do both of those!
Your windows will be NO cheaper if you use a company with a “scrappage scheme”.
All they do is pretend the windows cost more, then pretend to give you money off for your old ones!
It costs every company money to dispose of your old windows, they are NOT “paying you” for them. They really don’t want them!

A final quote that is so cheap you wonder how they can do it!
Often they probably can’t! If all else fails, the rep may offer you a price so cheap you can’t refuse it.
When your job is surveyed later you may get a call saying they can’t do it for that price, so you need to pay more or they will cancel it.
Many reps get their commission when you have paid a deposit, but cancellations are not deducted from them until the next month. So they can live on some borrowed money for a while, and they hope that you will be too embarassed to go back to any of the other companies who quoted & told you it couldn’t be done so cheaply.
Also they have made a “sale” & got their manager off their back for a while.
Sometimes if the job is heavily discounted, the company will fit your order, but you may get poorer quality windows or no reinforcing to get their costs down.

Staying for hours
We’ve all heard the horror stories of the sales rep who arrived at 9pm and didn’t leave until 1am!
Hopefully by this time you will be so tired or brainwashed that you will sign up just to get rid of them. You wouldn’t want to go through that experience again as you think all window companies will do the same.
Or maybe you will think that as the poor rep gave up so much of his time, you really should use him.
Remember many commission-only reps will only work one appointment per day. So even though he was at your house for 3 or 4 hours, that is all he worked that day!
Often appointments are purposely made for late evening so they can wear you down in this way.

Finance
Designed to make you think your windows are more affordable, by giving you a monthly payment. Look carefully at the total you will be paying.
If the rate seems cheap or is “interest free”, the finance company will be charging the window company interest, and this will have already been added to the cost of your windows.
Mostly the rate is very high, and that means the rep will be getting commission on the finance deal as well as the windows.
There are often high penalties for early repayment once you have realised, too late, just how much it will cost you.
A lot of sales training is given to make these finance deals sound much more attractive than they really are.
Try your bank first. Use these schemes as a last resort.

Now you are ready to start getting your quotes!

Hopefully, armed with this inside information, you will be able to avoid all these sales tricks, not waste hours with dodgy sales reps, and make a wise and informed decision in your own time.
And you KNOW to show the door to ANYONE who starts to use these tactics, or suddenly offers you thousands of pounds off for any reason!
There is no panic to “buy now”, they will still be selling the same windows at the same price tomorrow, whatever they say…
Use an honest company, that gives you a fair price straight away, doesn’t outstay their welcome or try to mislead you, and is happy to provide you with a written quotation to consider in your own time.
Help us say NO to dodgy double glazing sales tactics, and finally make buying windows a straightforward & enjoyable experience.

Anger and confusion about WER scheme

Sunday, February 7th, 2010

I’ve been reading with interest the lengthening thread on the Thermoseal blog about the Window Energy Scheme and its impact on our industry.

It appears that there are many people concerned that the impending changes to the WER scheme in October will have a devastating effect on many small IGU fabricators, PVCu manufacturers and installers. Many of the comments refer to small businesses being pushed out of business and people being forced onto the dole.

I am becoming increasingly concerned myself that the industry is just not ready to replace U-Values with WERs as the only way to comply with building regulations in such a short time scale.

The whole thing seems badly thought out, and there seems to be a lot of confusion about what the changes will actually mean to individual businesses. There are even people questioning the validity of the science behind the rating system.

Our company has successfully been marketing energy rated windows for some time now, but I’m particularly frustrated with the amount of unnecessary bureaucracy it entails and the lack of flexibility we now have with sealed unit product supply.

So, I’m trying to fix up to have an interview on the website with Giles Wilson of the BFRC, although I’m yet to get a response to my request. I want to ask him for clarity on a couple of questions I need clarifying, but I would also like to hear any constructive questions you might like me to put to him.

Please submit your questions below, and then I’ll compile the best 8 or 10 and send them to him.

All gone gas or Argon gas – which do you prefer?

Thursday, February 4th, 2010

Guest Post by Steve Massey

As Document L of the building regulations continues to be tightened for both new and existing dwellings, Argon gas filling will become a standard process in sealed unit production.

BS EN 1279 is now mandatory for all sealed unit manufacturers and clearly defines the rules for gas filling compliance. EN1279 part 3 states : units must be within -5%/+10% of a specified single gas concentration and must have a leakage rate of less than 1% per year, over a 10-year period. It is reasonable to take 90% as the concentration level for Argon, because this is the level that all WER windows are calculated at.

As part of our EN1279 part 6 compliance responsibilities, we have to undertake daily testing of our gas production. We are required to log and record the concentration levels for a minimum of 3 random units per day from the Argon batch. We actually test many more to check that all our systems are working correctly. This ensures that our customers will not be faced with a huge product recall due to either illegal or unfit for purpose products. Ask Toyota what their current recall issue is going to cost them.

argon gas analysis

Our calibrated external Sparklike Gas test machine gives instant readings of Argon content. We can test a unit that is in-situ glazed, as easily as testing units from our production. We would recommend that any window company buying gas filled sealed units asks their sealed unit supplier for the following:

• To visit their factory and view their gas production and testing systems
• Examine their EN1279 part 3 pass report
• To bring their in house gas testing machine to site and test the gas content of random units
• Repeat these actions regularly to ensure that they maintain quality.

We welcome window companies with any doubts about their products to bring a unit to our factory for a confidential Argon concentration test. We think that the peace of mind would be worth the trip.

Regards

Steve Massey
Regency Glass Ltd
www.regencyglass.co.uk
www.sparklike.com

Suicidal advertising methods of double glazing companies

Tuesday, February 2nd, 2010

I’ve been sent a few images of advertisements currently running in a newspaper in the West Midlands. I thought I’d share them with you, although I’ve edited out the company details for obvious reasons.

I’ve long been of the opinion that advertising in newspapers is a waste of advertising revenue, as there are fewer and fewer people using newspapers to find double glazing companies. People use the internet these days.

The other reason I feel advertising in newspapers is a waste of money, is you are competing with irresponsible installers like the following:

Example 1

suicidal-advertising1

This company suggests it has been trading for 19 years and offers a GGF insurance backed guarantee. Consumers will need to ensure they get this, as selling uPVC windows for £159 each, and doors for £385 they’ll need it.

Example 2

suicidal-advertising2

This company is offering a full house of windows for £1200. I’ve got over 30 windows in my house, so I better give them a ring, as we’re looking at less than £40 each!

Example 3

suicidal-advertising3

This company is showing pictures of conservatories that are clearly at least £12,000 conservatories, but suggesting that they can do them for £3,999 (inc fitting and base). For those people that can’t afford to pay only £3999 for a conservatory, they can even pay in 12 months!!!

Example 4

easyfit-conservatories2

Actually, this is the best deal. Conservatories for £2999 with free tiles or blinds, and free electrics!

Come on guys. I have no problem with price advertising, but starting at such low figures is not only undermining your own profit margins, it undermines the whole industry.

I realise that this is the way you feel you can generate most leads, and by advertising a better deal than your competitors you feel you’re going to get more calls than them. And, I realise that you don’t really sell at these prices, but the problem is that when you start so low, even if you’re good at upselling you’re still going to struggle to get to a sensible, sustainable price for your work.

Consumers are being price conditioned by such advertising, and the knock on effect is that professional operators, whether they like it or not have to compete try compete with these prices.

As an industry, we need to start competing on quality and service, and not on such ridiculous prices.

Worry about old timber windows, not uPVC!

Monday, February 1st, 2010

Guest Post by Martin Randall in response to this comment on a previous post

The timber industry is very active with spin about other materials but it would be best to stick with the facts.

PVC-U, UPVC or PVC does not give off fumes nor does it leach into the ground whether buried or not. PVC-U is a particularly inert material. Once it is manufactured into profile it lasts, and lasts, and lasts. Many of the windows installed in the 1980s by Local Authorities are being replaced with double glazed frames because they were single glazed to save money. Others are being replaced and upgraded so they are more secure or have better insulation, or because the hardware breaks down and is obsolete. But the PVC-U itself just goes on and on.

Early estimates of its lifetime have had to be revised upwards. PVC-U windows will clearly last 35 years with ease, but the material itself looks good for 70 years or more. It wouldn’t surprise anyone if, like concrete, it lasted much longer. The surface gets grubby and fades after a time, but that’s it. It resists burning and self extinguishes in fire. It doesn’t melt in normal fires. When it does burn, at very high temperatures, and long after timber has burned to a crisp, it does give off some fumes. All materials do. Timber for example gives off far more noxious dioxins than PVC-U which gives off just a trace.

The more we recycle the better. It’s just good house keeping. It’s a waste if we don’t, but buried PVC-U is not a hazard or danger to health.

Now if you are concerned about easily leached materials from the surface of window frames in landfill, consider the nasty materials from the coatings of old timber frames. Like PVC-U windows, timber windows can be recycled. They could be dismantled but you try scraping away the paint and breaking down the window into components. Most timber windows aren’t recycled as you can see from the contents of skips all around the country. Most replaced windows going into landfill are not PVC-U, they are timber. If you want to lie awake worried about window materials leaching into our water supplies, worry about old timber windows.

Martin Randall
Fighting Back With Facts
http://www.fightingbackwithfacts.com

Window Energy Ratings? Exchangeability?

Wednesday, January 27th, 2010

There’s an interesting blog post on the Thermoseal Group website, asking for opinions about the exchangeability of products deemed as ’similar’ being permitted in the WER scheme, so window companies and sealed unit suppliers are not bound to specific brands of a product.

You can leave your thoughts at:

http://www.thermosealgroup.com/blogs.cfm?theBlogID=B66D9A7F-15C5-F4C0-999A03944C8DBFDE

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