I was watching Look North this evening and the headline news was about a builder who stripped the roof off a house in Barlborough, Derbyshire after a long running dispute over payment.
Royden Toon, from Skegness, spent five hours tearing materials from the house roof until he was talked down by local police.
The builder claimed he was taking back his materials after James Arthur refused to pay fully for his extension.
“He wouldn’t pay so I went to take my materials back off the roof.
“I gave him a letter telling him what I was going to do, he walked off and that was it.”
But, Mr Arthur said he held back payment until the work was done satisfactorily. He said: “We had to terminate his contract.” He added the work had not been done satisfactorily and was six months late in completion.
“He was on a fixed fee, of which he received just over three quarters of the money and he hadn’t got the finances to progress the works satisfactorily.”
The story reminds me of a similar story I featured earlier in the year when a builder Nigel Gray took back a conservatory and porch after his customer would not pay.
I’m sure many of my readers will sympathise with the builder’s actions here, but the wider question is how can we avoid getting to this situation in the first place. Is it a case of a rogue customer, or should the builder behave more professionally?
Tags: barlborough roof, look north, Rogue Customers, Rogue Traders, royden toon
I have seen this sort of thing happen in Asia but not in the UK before. With so many rogue builders out there I think there should be provisions to protect the general public, especially the pensioners.
Get your facts correct andy clark before you decide to make a comment. This is a case of rogue customer not rogue builder! Why do people highlight rogue builders but not decent, honest, hardworking builders who get done over by the customer. This case was caused by the homeowner and scheming architect. This whole case has caused so much stress to Mr Toon it resulted in him suffering a heart attack a while ago. Why is there not more to protect the honest business man, Mr Toon has only been made to look like the criminal in this whole situation. If a customer took products from the shelf of a shop and walked out without paying, that person is classed as a thief. Whats the difference?
Hi Samantha
I think you’ll find that on the whole this site and its readers are sympathetic to those workmen who come across rogue customers (although I am unaware of the background with Mr Toon). See previous post:
http://renegadeconservatoryguy.co.uk/rogue-customers-nigel-gray-launches-a-new-website-roguecustomercom/
RCG
So another builder is pushed over the edge by a cowboy customer and resorts to taking back his materials, or at least, ensuring that his crooked client does not have the benefit of them.
What is the alternative to this extreme kind of action? – Go to law? – Forget it!!!
Take a look at my website and look what happened to me!!!
I trusted the legal system to get me my money back from these kind of crooks, but, had I known what a waste of time it would be, I would have been the first to go in with a sledgehammer and smash all of my works to smithereens.
Because of non payment, I lost my home, my property, everything that meant anything to me, whilst my crooked client ended up making a profit of approx £100,000, and all courtesy of our corrupt and ineffectual legal system
Completely sympathise with the builder. The evasive and abusive end to the contract by stating late completion and poor work sounds like a corporate type attidude to a private business arrangement. The rogue customer has been on the increase of late and this ‘appears’ to be one of those. I’m sorry the lady on the bbc video clip was upset, but she really has to ask her husband why he was such a berk not paying or resolving this conflict well within 5 years…..5 YEARS!!!! The fact that the builder had a heart attack because of this tells me that he suffered well beyond reasonable amounts. This has affected his family too, and most likely his business via cash flow issues….something customers in general have no concept of…and most likely not even bothered about….another case of trying to get a cheap job cheaper. In essesence, two families have now been largely affected by what appears to be an idiot unwilling to resolve issues with his builder.
My experaince with building/builders is that you do hold final payment (usually 10% not 25%), raise issues, get them resolved then settle……5 years in my opinion is one selfish tight individual trying to scam some poor builder.
Well done to the builder and good luck to him. Boo to the customer, sorry to his wife and kids.
I think every one of us has had a smart customer, who makes all the right noises at the start of a job but at the end they always find a reason not to give the final payment.
Unfortunately it is not against the law to owe money and if a customer chooses not to pay there is little you can do to force payment, the courts may give you judgement but they do not make the smart people pay.
Nigel Gray’s rogue customer website might be the way forward, I have had non payers with CCJs in abundance, one in particular, owed us over £2000.00, offered £10.00 per month and the judge decided as she was a single, unemployed mother we would have to accept over 16 years to be payed. She made 3 payments, sold up and moved. We did not chase her.
mike harvey-rice . I fully agree.
The English legal system works in favour of the dishonest and unscrupulous , as far as personal debt is concerned.
An already bad situation has been made much worse by the introduction of civil bankruptcy whereby individuals can -and do- knowingly rack up personal debt with no intention whatsoever of repaying.
If a graduate student can have a higher tax code attached to their life time earnings in order to repay their (government) loan, then I fail to see why a ‘debtors tax’ cannot be equally levied- with proceeds going directly to the plaintive.
Perhaps its just the case that as long as the government and legal beaks get their money, then the rest of us can go and get f*****.
The real issue here is the builder acting as a lender. He is not a lender, he is a builder. If finance is required, then there are specialist companies who will provide it. Such companies ensure that they are able to collect; usually by securing the loan against the house itself. If the client claims he can’t get a loan from the bank… then you certainly should not be giving him credit! Have the total fee escrowed before you start and ensure that there is an independent arbitrator able to determine whether you have met the terms required for each payment.
I totally understand issues builders are facing today, my husband has a small family building firm operating for 30 years – when someone decides not to pay there is no protection for hard working builders. When a customer recently did not pay my husband, my husband made the decision to stop work, only to be told by the court that he was in breech of contract. What is he suppose to do when his buisness is in jeopardy if he is not being paid?? unfortunately at the present time there are people out there who are getting building work done for free and making a tidy profit, whilst small genuine buisnesses are going bust. I do sympathise for the children in this situation and really hope that their parent protected them, but my heart goes to Mr Toon and his family. Hopefully laws will be looked at here? at the end of the day, if this family didnt ever pay -do they own the property??
Sarah says that, “Hopefully laws will be looked at here”. There is no ‘hopefully’ about it Sarah.
Albeit, against the will of lawyers, we have got to make them change the laws in the interests of every hard working and honest builder who has ever been screwed by the ’system’ and all the poor souls who are next in line. Come the court hearing, I am willing to stand alongside Royden Toon and make my voice heard.
Royden did not get fully paid for a job of works and took the law into his own hands by ‘taking back’ materials that were unpaid for.
I, on the other hand, did not get fully paid for my works and went to law for redress.
The result? I still did not get paid but, unlike Royden, I did not have the satisfaction of knowing that his client had not gained from his loss.
How many others are willing to support Royden with me?
The time is long overdue for hitting back.
Hi. I would like to stand up and be counted, as suggested by Colin Peters. As a retired builder with over £100K owing to me, I am fed up with Rogue Customers. Having said that, God bless my good customers !
What can we do ? Can we lobby Parliment, can we make a difference ? As I said in an email to Colin, what we need is an EQUALIZER !
I have seen the workmanship of Toon, no wondre the guy has not paid up fully but just what the quality of the work was worth.
The builder is a shoddy worker, just look at his own home, not a good advertisement for yourself! enough said.
you can’t take the law into your own hands, you deserve to be locked up for this!
I am a member of Rouge Customer.com and attended their meeting at Westminster with Tim Laughton MP. Unfortunately I don’t think we will see any legal changes in the near future that will assist/protect us the supplier or fitter of goods. With monies owed to me by various domestic customers, which is increasing on a monthly basis, I decided to try what appeared to be a modern day debt recovery service. It is run by a firm of solicitors, who it has to be said are very, very efficient. I gave them details of the 1st matter to deal with, and within 3 weeks received a cheque for the full amount. I then gave them details of a 2nd case and again within 4 weeks I have a cheque in full settlement. Needless to say details of the next case are being sent to them. This is not a fail safe option, but at least I am making some sort of headway in clearing up monies owed to me by THE CUSTOMER.
I too was at the Westminster launch of Roguecustomer.com and was allowed to address those present, not very effectively I’m afraid since I had prepared an half hours presentation, only to find that I was allocated just a few minutes.
My own fault entirely. I should have checked beforehand how much time I would have!!
However, although I had high hopes, I now have the same misgivings as Chris LLewellyn
about legal changes in the near future.
I watched Nigel Gray on GMTV this morning when he stated to the interviewer that he had not had a reply from a government member to a dossier which he sent him 28 days ago.
There is no doubting Nigels enthusiasm or ability, but when those in power, (Those who the public put in power!) refuse to respond, or are sloth like in responding to a man who is representing the interests of a great many people, then where do we go from there?
It would seem that the only way to get attention is through the kind of actions recently displayed firstly by Nigel and then by Royden.
What’s that old saying? ‘Actions speak louder than words’ and if the powers that be wont listen, then we’ve got to make them listen somehow.
Always Cheap work cheaper.
that what makes builders life hard, unfortunately for builders who can not afford lawyers fee and architects who are valuating the job stage by stage.
I am one of them making loose all the time, because snagging is bigger than the contract itself. I am only hoping the times come back when can price 25% on top off all.
btw.
Recently discovered cutting of wires in clients new sockets boxes is pleasing me.
and best regards to my good customer who are exist to.
I employed a handyman from our Council’s Fair Traders list to install 3 floor cupboards from flatpacks in my dining room. His ad said “family business” (he’s 1 s/employed man). He turned up an hour and a half late. Then refused to make pilot holes for any screws so most of them went in crooked. To cut a long story short, the drawer fronts are out of alignment, vertically and horizontally, some screws are half hanging out, the doors need aligning. Plus the worktop (he caused a small chip in the corner) is in square (despite a slight bow in the wall centre of three eighths of an inch.) But the units are at an angle (shorter overhang one end than other)
Had to pay him as not sure of legal position. Trading Standards eventually agreed to negotiate. The result is because I said I didn’t want him to come back because he’d probably make it worse, he now accuses me of trying to extort money out of him for compensation.
Luckily for me a building company rep called last week. He was so disgusted with the standard, he took photos and says he will report it to Trading Standards and possibly DTI.
I’ve tried to find out any previous compaints against this workman under Freedom of Information but my request was rejected.
The problem in the UK is that anyone can set up as a handyman, small builder etc. Even if someone passes a Carpentry City & Guilds Course, it only takes 6 weeks!
How is it I can read reviews of products, holidays, films and plays before I spend but not building firms, handymen etc.
I have been diagnosed with cancer so I don’t want the stress of Small Claims Courts. Even if I get my money back it won’t stop this man from doing it again to someone else!